作者查詢 / valenci
作者 valenci 在 PTT [ Hiking ] 看板的留言(推文), 共364則
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收起看板(1558)
28F→:心聞沒一個現役文大登山...卻用文大登山申請....06/10 12:16
1F→:第三段前半真是很無言 主因是迷路加硬切溪摔傷吧? 921?06/07 21:07
44F→:改善也要看這社會願意出多少資源 要說加大資源很簡單...05/11 23:26
45F推:白姑這樣說也不對 民間救難組織，分別花了兩天 那是阿諾05/11 23:30
46F→:他之前也很多民搜去呀05/11 23:30
47F→:所以現在是只要後搜的多日後找到 就是前面的人有問題嗎?05/12 00:16
48F→:http://ppt.cc/Bhnb 22篇 23篇05/12 00:24
77F→:也不是說什麼有錯沒錯 而是不接受有其自身要承擔的風險05/13 00:20
83F推:登山補給站有人說 新聞說女友說有水聲 之前民搜都沒聽女05/14 17:39
84F→:友說過...05/14 17:40
1F→:找到後家屬報怨切溪不夠 如果新聞屬實 山青也不該不敢下卻04/29 17:36
2F→:跟家屬說找過就是 我這樣說很嚴重嗎?就人類歷史跟全球04/29 17:37
3F→:真要檢討就是各方都實事求是 不能因自利或自開脫亂講04/29 17:38
4F→:新聞又一個說什麼撐50天 依殯葬講法.....04/29 17:42
5F→:台灣新聞亂源 我還記得失蹤後寒流 有啥原因不搭帳??04/29 17:43
6F→:我是覺得不論是家屬 民搜 官搜 阿諾都要照實04/29 17:44
7F→:現在新聞亂亂猜 說難聽家屬也有所偏自己04/29 17:45
8F→:我也知那新聞 引阿諾說法 但現在的新聞可信度悲哀04/29 17:50
9F→:家屬當然很...但有的家屬看到情況這樣會節哀吧04/29 17:57
31F→:要以阿諾為標準就政府高薪聘他當臨時指揮大頭 試試04/29 18:30
32F→:其他民搜 都沒想到04/29 18:31
35F→:那要不要怪官搜(家屬主調)04/29 18:50
36F→: 我也希望呀 但果也是想問 阿諾都兩次主搜完找到04/29 18:51
37F→:我想知道南湖都說過 但這次民搜跟原民還是在水管看看就...04/29 18:52
38F→:或下一點就...退 這些人為何選退跟沒看到??04/29 18:53
39F→:sorry 激動些04/29 18:54
54F推:不過昨天哲青說我們登山人....下切找水04/30 12:49
1F推:說的簡單 不可能方向 四面八方有多少? 這還只是方向04/29 15:46
2F→:還不論各方向沒路的不知哪的偏僻地點04/29 15:47
3F推:我是這麼認為啦 這案如果手機跟當日遇見者查訪難推方向04/29 15:49
4F→:往白姑主線當然會被當重點 連主逕能括200m都阿彌陀佛了04/29 15:51
6F→:從紅香出發的可能東南西北 任何地含自開陸 幾個知那邊??04/29 15:52
7F→:黃先生之前南湖事件批過搜救方式 我比教想知他的推論方法04/29 15:54
8F→:昨天看完關鍵時刻 都懷疑他體質上特別有[緣](誤)04/29 15:56
9F→:很不能認同登山補給站有的人說 民搜義務沒找到ok 官方怎能04/29 15:57
10F→:找到 這種想法是認為民搜不夠專算了嗎??結果民搜高手黃找04/29 15:59
11F→:到還是[不怪]其他民搜怪官 ???我是覺得這不是怪誰問題了04/29 16:00
12F→:我不是說這也要怪民搜 而且有時機運跟危險度落差04/29 16:05
13F→:為什麼就要說 官搜要負責 但民搜很多人去水管路找一段04/29 16:06
14F→:沒發現就ok(我還認為民搜應比官搜強^^)04/29 16:07
15F→:就新聞我都懷疑阿若先生通靈了(誤) 下一段(為什麼想下)04/29 16:09
16F→:望遠鏡又剛好看到人工物?04/29 16:10
17F推:怪官的總是以阿若來怪官 家屬不怪民應民多無償但判斷還是.04/29 16:12
18F→:用這點比較 民搜自然弱? 官搜怎可不知?很奇怪04/29 16:13
19F→:我不是怪民搜 是因為民除那次高手都沒人想到 這算官錯04/29 16:14
20F推:那這次還是民找到 之前民沒發現不怪 官沒發現怪?很奇怪04/29 16:19
21F→:私以為難找地點後來被發現 不論之前官民都沒想到的有沒啥04/29 16:20
22F→:好怪 那聽說黃也找過2008向陽江秋萍事件 至今都沒找到04/29 16:22
23F→:官民都沒找到 就沒檢討找法議題?04/29 16:22
24F→:就一般鄉民情感上 這次出主徑為主的資源很夠意思了04/29 16:25
25F→:那時我都說找到XX都算幸運了 結果現在變責難問題...04/29 16:26
26F推:我實在非長討厭這次的家屬親友放款的消息跟八掛po文04/29 16:28
27F→:結束官定期限時還猛批政府不延 還有事發時到某版徵認識民04/29 16:30
28F→:代 是後找到北市市議員帶[北市]消防到中部04/29 16:30
29F推:話說家屬fb把當時外國靈媒標的地點圖刪了嗎?04/29 16:34
30F→:這事件開頭跟之後可感受 家人有人愛他到四處po04/29 16:36
31F→:但我還是想說有其自己該承受的部份04/29 16:36
36F→:那時這版還討論外國靈媒翻譯....04/29 16:50
37F→:#1DSa5SF_ (Hiking) 我也忘了標哪 跟找到處相符嗎?04/29 16:51
40F→: 這點南胡溪阿偌就有說過 但事實上是否有奇他問題?04/29 16:59
41F推:我是說事後很容易說應[相反方向]但在前期不只相反呀04/29 17:03
42F→:四方不夠 8方 16方 還不夠涵蓋所有偏僻無徑??04/29 17:04
43F推:我這樣會不會很殘忍 離路切溪還切到很扯的 希望上電視讓04/29 17:07
44F→:大多人知道(尤其山友還沒裝備) 有篇新聞阿諾安慰家屬說:04/29 17:09
45F→:你兒子很大膽 很厲害 可惜我來晚了 但另一篇說 想不通他怎04/29 17:10
46F→:麼徒手下去(連老手猛到爆的阿諾去找都嚇到然後用工具下)04/29 17:12
47F→:感謝阿諾也希望他小心 他這兩次找到一般人聽敘述 好危險04/29 17:13
49F→:rome 我也這嚜想 不過不要怪我對阿諾不敬 1.他兩次都是大04/29 17:17
50F→:部隊很久後去(是否去時有排除大部對找過的點?)04/29 17:17
51F推:2.這次怪官搜很多 但這次一堆民搜到水管路要下 不是嚇退04/29 17:19
52F→:就是想想也不可能???? 文政隊說有下過04/29 17:20
53F→:我這樣太殘忍嗎?就事實運作 我希望所有山友都以南湖 白姑04/29 17:22
54F→:這兩案為痛例 當你自以為下溪 還一直下 你就必需承擔風險04/29 17:23
55F→:rip的人當然就...但在這種地方很久後被找到的 要認命較好04/29 17:24
56F→:要說這樣要加強奇怪溪 山那嚜大 主徑旁你真要亂離徑是無限04/29 17:26
57F推:太扯的 家屬也要擔部份責任吧 理論上找不到 誰都能說有04/29 17:34
58F→:但實際上(除非是明顯在主路徑不遠的) 各為忍苛責?04/29 17:35
60F→:sorry04/29 18:10
1F推:我是覺得要檢討的話 也是要就過程 不能太結果論心態04/29 08:04
6F→:但現實就是 整個社會願意投多少成本找罕例 這樣值的嗎?04/29 13:10
7F→:我這樣算是直指重點吧? 為什麼黃那隊外 之前不論政搜民搜04/29 13:11
8F→:沒想到或想到有一咪咪可能但看到地形不可能吧 退的???04/29 13:12
9F→:就事後論跟[理論]想能開到最大 但現實可行???04/29 13:13
18F推:推樓上 就成本我不願投太多去做為危險 偏遠地搜04/29 15:25
19F→:當然就偏山的想要很讚的體系 登山補幾都討論到uav04/29 15:26
20F→: 一般選民最好肯花這成本04/29 15:26
21F→:現實上我會很殘忍的說 你偏太偏僻 什麼奇怪溪下 rip04/29 15:28
22F→:能找到遺體算你好運了04/29 15:28
23F→:不過黃國書先生都兩次溪 功力還是無法轉移給民搜?還是到一04/29 15:29
24F→:定靈敢程度是無法訓練別人到同等能力?04/29 15:30
25F→:如果以結果論 跟高度搜遍論(怎有可能) 2008嘉明湖江小姐事04/29 17:29
26F→:件 聽說阿諾也去找過 那過程有沒該檢討處 還是民官都失敗04/29 17:30
27F→:就...沒什麼好討論過程?04/29 17:30
29F→:記得這版某處看過 大搜無獲後 兩年後碰巧被遇到白骨....04/29 19:01
30F→:這還算有找到的04/29 19:01
3F→:看到瀑布那幾張 ....驚04/29 07:55
10F→:我看圖後 誰會想到下這種地方 窘04/29 10:17
12F→:我還比較想知道黃先生的整體推斷過程04/29 11:19
13F→:登山補給有的人說民間奇他沒想到ok畢竟民間但官方就不行04/29 11:21
15F→:看影片 大石旁是候來搬出去的(新聞說本想直升機吊)04/29 17:14
16F→:第2行 是從溪邊隱匿小樹下抬出來的樣子04/29 17:15
18F→:樓上看影片 是溪抬出跳接抬到大石邊 搭配我看到一則新聞04/29 17:46
19F→:本來要直升機來吊 後來條件不行 改抬下山04/29 17:47
20F→:話說自由有一篇 有阿諾提供找到背包照片 在有樹斜坡04/29 17:48
21F→:(推側人在被包更下面溪邊處) 不過這樣看張生傷還是挪溪旁04/29 17:49
5F推:你說硬切不回頭得例越來越多 就五個性怎覺得是罕例呀??04/29 16:42
6F→:#1DkQOhOQ 我承認我沒膽沒裝備(就算有我也不會用)連切下去04/29 16:43
7F→:登補站有人說官方也尊中意見喔 但文政切一點也沒看到04/29 16:45
8F→:有人313找溯溪山友下水管也不敢下或想不可能吧?04/29 16:47
9F→:你說硬切溪不回頭很誇張的例越來越多 要統計一下04/29 16:48
10F→:較有明就黃先生的搜到南湖跟這次 其間有沒其他???04/29 16:49
12F→:有誰要統計一下嗎?下溪遠不論生死被找到vs主徑附近不論生04/29 17:56
13F→:死被找到04/29 17:56
15F推:sorry04/29 18:09
102F→:樓上問的很好呀你說的加強是官?民?跟多少錢??04/29 17:39
103F→:我反而反向思考 上山預防遠重於治療04/29 17:40
104F→:下切水後留原地算了 (或是有力上爬) 獨攀獨迷還衝可怕長下04/29 17:52
105F→:溪 我殘忍說怪不了別人04/29 17:52
106F→:問一下 有幾個沒工具 獨攀獨迷狂下溪到很扯的生還?04/29 17:54
108F→:太離譜的 一般民很實際的說rip04/29 18:32
109F推: 不要說台灣D台有千鈞一髮集 那些走偏很偏 不是夠04/29 18:58
110F→:幸運的話 RIP也不奇怪呀04/29 18:59
113F→:貝爾大叔旁還有工作團隊04/30 12:50
1F→:依新聞 這隊有下去溯北港溪 也剛好沒找到所在處....04/28 20:05
8F→:另外是R.I.P 蘇醫師 常幫人找尋的山友也請注意自身安全04/28 20:34
11F→: 所以需要真實報告 各新聞寫的很....語焉不詳04/28 20:36
12F→:那篇是說黃國書先生研判有受傷 內褲有寫等語....04/28 20:37
13F→:猜是中傷?還有白紙壓石字跡被沖等 這是新聞說的 也不知新04/28 20:38
15F→:聞有沒失真 還說沒在帳內還是沒搭起04/28 20:40
17F→:所以希望這類事都能有官方紀錄(在隱私許可下)當案例04/28 20:41
18F→:各方說法 跟各新聞說法很雜亂 很想知道黃先生是不是排除04/28 20:42
21F→:先前搜過的才鎖定04/28 20:43
22F→:那時聽到手機斷是猜摔 或是走到無訊處或手機沒電04/28 20:44
23F→:現在都很各方片面 要真實還原應該收集各方的事件順序實錄04/28 20:46
24F→:上面那些找到情況都記者寫的 不知有沒有失真...04/28 20:54